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RE: Questions about 9/11 - 1/26/2010 3:13:43 PM
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cow451
Posts: 3519
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quote:
ORIGINAL: cornergas
Hey Cow got to quit believing the manufactured corporate media...spouting their propaganda and use that thing on your shoulders..if you do that you will see it is not a big leap to know the truth..but as long as you follow the nutbar government, and their controlled media you will continue will the old stereotype rhetoric, which has no thought behind it, but merely has you parroting the official party line...
Know the truth and it will set you free
Remember the Sabbath to keep it Holy
God bless us all!
Speaking of rhetoric... let me know when you have something to go with it.
_____________________________
"It's an effort to elevate one's language to sound more academic, more scholarly," Lucas said. "I don't think I'd give her an A for anything."- Brad Lucas of TCU on Palin's refudiate gaffe
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RE: Questions about 9/11 - 1/26/2010 3:29:21 PM
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tsnody2001
Posts: 1019
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From: Terre Haute, IN
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quote:
Speaking of rhetoric... let me know when you have something to go with it.
We have, and you conveniently dismiss it all as not valid or "conspiracy". It only counts as evidence if you give it the okay.
_____________________________
Until He Returns (Rev. 2:17),
Travis
During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act. ~George Orwell
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RE: Questions about 9/11 - 1/26/2010 6:01:24 PM
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cow451
Posts: 3519
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quote:
ORIGINAL: tsnody2001
quote:
Speaking of rhetoric... let me know when you have something to go with it.
We have, and you conveniently dismiss it all as not valid or "conspiracy". It only counts as evidence if you give it the okay.
I've looked at the evidence people point out. If you got something new, I'll check it out. Just spare me the You Tube Science. The points of contention are about the extraordinary leaps of logic some folks are making that are not supported by the body of evidence.
_____________________________
"It's an effort to elevate one's language to sound more academic, more scholarly," Lucas said. "I don't think I'd give her an A for anything."- Brad Lucas of TCU on Palin's refudiate gaffe
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RE: Questions about 9/11 - 1/31/2010 2:14:38 PM
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cornergas
Posts: 510
Joined: 7/28/2009
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It is strange how some people who support the government's official conspiracy theory, refuse to open their minds and follow up on the thousands of available resources to get at the truth in the 9/11 incidents...many professional people and eye witnesses, victims families, as well as leaders of other countries are asking for a real investigation of 9/11, because they know the official theory is not credible..yet the government refuses to investigate and provide answers to the questions put forward by these groups..Now some people dismiss these people in derogatory terms, for having a brain and using it to try and get answers to the very pertinent questions created by 9/11 and the lack of credible investigation. The groups include ...Airline pilots, architects, engineers, military people, some media people, etc..all these groups consist of thousands of professionals, who completely disagree with the governments "theory" based on factual evidence, and as such want a true investigation done..and justice done is this regard..Is that too much to ask? Just google any of the above groups, and follow the links, and all your questions will be answered and you will know the truth!
Know the truth and it will set you free
Remember the Sabbath to keep it Holy!
God bless us all!
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RE: Questions about 9/11 - 2/2/2010 9:30:42 AM
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Eutychus
Posts: 9221
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Dothan, AL
Status: online
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quote:
ORIGINAL: cornergas
It is strange how some people who support the government's official conspiracy theory, refuse to open their minds and follow up on the thousands of available resources to get at the truth in the 9/11 incidents...many professional people and eye witnesses, victims families, as well as leaders of other countries are asking for a real investigation of 9/11, because they know the official theory is not credible..yet the government refuses to investigate and provide answers to the questions put forward by these groups..Now some people dismiss these people in derogatory terms, for having a brain and using it to try and get answers to the very pertinent questions created by 9/11 and the lack of credible investigation. The groups include ...Airline pilots, architects, engineers, military people, some media people, etc..all these groups consist of thousands of professionals, who completely disagree with the governments "theory" based on factual evidence, and as such want a true investigation done..and justice done is this regard..Is that too much to ask? Just google any of the above groups, and follow the links, and all your questions will be answered and you will know the truth!
I find it interesting that that sounds much like the statements I've read and heard from people claiming that UFOs are constantly around us and that ETAs have taken over the minds and bodies of all government leaders so that nobody but the UFOers can be trusted to tell the truth - and part of the "evidence" is that anyone dares disagree with them.
_____________________________
Jesus answered and said to them, "This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent." -John 6:29
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RE: Questions about 9/11 - 2/2/2010 1:09:53 PM
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tsnody2001
Posts: 1019
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From: Terre Haute, IN
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You know Eutychus, you can play the 'what-stupid-thing-can-I-associate-this-movement-with' game all you like. That argument is no better than those who are afraid to debate, so they equate the opposing view with Holocaust deniers, tin foil hat club members, etc., which is totally ridiculous. Why don't you try to think independently for a change?
_____________________________
Until He Returns (Rev. 2:17),
Travis
During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act. ~George Orwell
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RE: Questions about 9/11 - 2/2/2010 1:48:16 PM
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Eutychus
Posts: 9221
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Dothan, AL
Status: online
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quote:
ORIGINAL: tsnody2001
You know Eutychus, you can play the 'what-stupid-thing-can-I-associate-this-movement-with' game all you like. That argument is no better than those who are afraid to debate, so they equate the opposing view with Holocaust deniers, tin foil hat club members, etc., which is totally ridiculous. Why don't you try to think independently for a change?
You know, tsnody2001, I haven't read any independent thinking in this thread from the conspiracy side.
And it wasn't independent thinking in here that led to these unsupported paranoid conspiracy theories. It's all been consumed from other self-appointed experts that see a cosmos out of God's control and, then, regurgitated here without realistic appraisal. That isn't independent. And it isn't credible.
During the 40 years I knew him before his death, my father-in-law also eagerly accepted every conspiracy theory like the ones in this thread. Not a single one ever turned out to be true. Yet, he swallowed the next one and told everyone he could how Democrats, Republicans, Independents, Media, Illuminati, Masons, Catholics, and any other group they despised were ALL in cahoots to fool all us goobers who couldn't accept their amazing revelations based on incontrovertible evidence.
He passed away about 18 months ago. About all he left as a legacy is mounds of reports on conspiracies that never, ever, proved true.
_____________________________
Jesus answered and said to them, "This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent." -John 6:29
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RE: Questions about 9/11 - 2/2/2010 2:39:31 PM
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tsnody2001
Posts: 1019
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From: Terre Haute, IN
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I'm sorry for your loss.
_____________________________
Until He Returns (Rev. 2:17),
Travis
During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act. ~George Orwell
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RE: Questions about 9/11 - 2/2/2010 4:51:28 PM
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cow451
Posts: 3519
Joined: 5/6/2005
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Eutychus
quote:
ORIGINAL: tsnody2001
You know Eutychus, you can play the 'what-stupid-thing-can-I-associate-this-movement-with' game all you like. That argument is no better than those who are afraid to debate, so they equate the opposing view with Holocaust deniers, tin foil hat club members, etc., which is totally ridiculous. Why don't you try to think independently for a change?
You know, tsnody2001, I haven't read any independent thinking in this thread from the conspiracy side.
And it wasn't independent thinking in here that led to these unsupported paranoid conspiracy theories. It's all been consumed from other self-appointed experts that see a cosmos out of God's control and, then, regurgitated here without realistic appraisal. That isn't independent. And it isn't credible.
During the 40 years I knew him before his death, my father-in-law also eagerly accepted every conspiracy theory like the ones in this thread. Not a single one ever turned out to be true. Yet, he swallowed the next one and told everyone he could how Democrats, Republicans, Independents, Media, Illuminati, Masons, Catholics, and any other group they despised were ALL in cahoots to fool all us goobers who couldn't accept their amazing revelations based on incontrovertible evidence.
He passed away about 18 months ago. About all he left as a legacy is mounds of reports on conspiracies that never, ever, proved true.
Did your FIL have a twin brother?
_____________________________
"It's an effort to elevate one's language to sound more academic, more scholarly," Lucas said. "I don't think I'd give her an A for anything."- Brad Lucas of TCU on Palin's refudiate gaffe
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RE: Questions about 9/11 - 2/3/2010 9:36:00 PM
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tsnody2001
Posts: 1019
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From: Terre Haute, IN
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Here is a documentary investigating some of the evidence that deals with 9/11, but I am sure that some here will call it "YouTube Science" (  wink wink, you know who you are) even though it has nothing to do with YouTube. Besides, YouTube is just an avenue in which people are able to present media to us. Just because something is on YouTube doesn't make it lose its credibility. But, that is irrelevant since this video is not from YouTube (not this particular link, anyway) but is from Google Video. 
ZERO: An Investigation Into 9/11
Edited to add a bit of information about documentary.
It is about 1hour 45minutes long and includes testimony of many eyewitnesses, experts (real experts), and family members of 9/11 victims. I recommend watching the WHOLE film just to be able to see the father who lost his son on 9/11, at the end of the film.
< Message edited by tsnody2001 -- 2/4/2010 12:57:00 AM >
_____________________________
Until He Returns (Rev. 2:17),
Travis
During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act. ~George Orwell
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RE: Questions about 9/11 - 2/4/2010 12:50:23 PM
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cornergas
Posts: 510
Joined: 7/28/2009
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TS Nody..How you doing? Those other guys appear to be living in the past and too concerned with their freaky FIL to objectively read reports to obtain the truth on 9/11. When they grow up, they will get it!!!
Know the truth and it will set you free
Remember the Sabbath to keep it Holy
God bless us all!.
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RE: Questions about 9/11 - 2/4/2010 1:21:01 PM
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cow451
Posts: 3519
Joined: 5/6/2005
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: cornergas
TS Nody..How you doing? Those other guys appear to be living in the past and too concerned with their freaky FIL to objectively read reports to obtain the truth on 9/11. When they grow up, they will get it!!!
Know the truth and it will set you free
Remember the Sabbath to keep it Holy
God bless us all!.
Does living in the past include thinking the "pancake theory" is still part of the "official" line?
_____________________________
"It's an effort to elevate one's language to sound more academic, more scholarly," Lucas said. "I don't think I'd give her an A for anything."- Brad Lucas of TCU on Palin's refudiate gaffe
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RE: Questions about 9/11 - 2/4/2010 1:32:23 PM
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cow451
Posts: 3519
Joined: 5/6/2005
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quote:
ORIGINAL: tsnody2001
Here is a documentary investigating some of the evidence that deals with 9/11, but I am sure that some here will call it "YouTube Science" ( wink wink, you know who you are) even though it has nothing to do with YouTube. Besides, YouTube is just an avenue in which people are able to present media to us. Just because something is on YouTube doesn't make it lose its credibility. But, that is irrelevant since this video is not from YouTube (not this particular link, anyway) but is from Google Video.
ZERO: An Investigation Into 9/11
Edited to add a bit of information about documentary.
It is about 1hour 45minutes long and includes testimony of many eyewitnesses, experts (real experts), and family members of 9/11 victims. I recommend watching the WHOLE film just to be able to see the father who lost his son on 9/11, at the end of the film.
Is there anything new as far as evidence? There are experts on all sides. Are these new eyewitnesses?
With all due respects the familiy members of the victims do not have anything to do with the issue of whether this-or-that theory holds water. They are used to provoke an emotional response only. BTW, the DVD is available for $19.95.
_____________________________
"It's an effort to elevate one's language to sound more academic, more scholarly," Lucas said. "I don't think I'd give her an A for anything."- Brad Lucas of TCU on Palin's refudiate gaffe
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RE: Questions about 9/11 - 2/4/2010 2:58:45 PM
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tsnody2001
Posts: 1019
Joined: 4/29/2008
From: Terre Haute, IN
Status: offline
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Why buy the DVD when you can watch it for free on the internet. What does that have to do with anything? STOP with the straw-men, cow451!
Eutychus, I am very sorry for you loss. I really am. And I understand where you are coming from in regards to posts from the "conspiracy" crew that belittle and ridicule others. I wish that were different. It saddens me that people feel they have to belittle others (even if they are right) in order to get their point across.
But enough with the straw-men arguments. Ridiculing statements, as much as they are foolish, have nothing to do with the evidence. The evidence, if you look at it objectively, shows that parts of the "official" story cannot possibly be true and are outright lies meant to deceive and cover up.
I just don't understand why people get ridiculed and called names such as "conspiracy nut/theorist", etc., because they have decided to ask some questions. I don't claim to the know who was involved. All I know is that the official story doesn't add up. I don't go into looking at the evidence with my mind already made up as far as who or what may or may not be responsible. If a prosecutor who is prosecuting a murder case somehow realizes the evidence doesn't add up to the "official" way that he has explained things took place, he would be obstructing justice if he did not continue to ask questions and try to look at the evidence from a different perspective (and seek more, new evidence). He would be doing a serious injustice to himself, the defendant and his/her family, as well as the victim and his/her family.
Cow451, I would say the same to you as I have said to Eutychus. Just stop with the straw-men. Regardless of whether the "pancake theory" is still part of the "official" story or not has no bearing on the evidence. Please don't refuse to see evidence because it doesn't fit into your preconceived construction of what happened, or because you don't want to give room for the possibility that you may have been lied to and deceived. I know. It hurts when you realize you have been lied to and deceived by someone you thought loved and cared for you. I'm not saying you are refusing to look at evidence, I am just asking you not to if you are.
Anyway, I've spent enough time on this post for now. I hope each of you are blessed today! I really do.
_____________________________
Until He Returns (Rev. 2:17),
Travis
During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act. ~George Orwell
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RE: Questions about 9/11 - 2/4/2010 3:00:03 PM
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tsnody2001
Posts: 1019
Joined: 4/29/2008
From: Terre Haute, IN
Status: offline
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quote:
Is there anything new as far as evidence?
Watch it and find out.
_____________________________
Until He Returns (Rev. 2:17),
Travis
During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act. ~George Orwell
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RE: Questions about 9/11 - 2/4/2010 3:39:28 PM
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cow451
Posts: 3519
Joined: 5/6/2005
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quote:
ORIGINAL: tsnody2001
Why buy the DVD when you can watch it for free on the internet. What does that have to do with anything? STOP with the straw-men, cow451!
Cow451, I would say the same to you as I have said to Eutychus. Just stop with the straw-men. Regardless of whether the "pancake theory" is still part of the "official" story or not has no bearing on the evidence. Please don't refuse to see evidence because it doesn't fit into your preconceived construction of what happened, or because you don't want to give room for the possibility that you may have been lied to and deceived. I know. It hurts when you realize you have been lied to and deceived by someone you thought loved and cared for you. I'm not saying you are refusing to look at evidence, I am just asking you not to if you are.
Anyway, I've spent enough time on this post for now. I hope each of you are blessed today! I really do.
The fact that this group is selling videos is information. Some might want to have it because of better quality viewing or to show it to others. Or it might be good to know that some people profit from the Truther movement. The Truthers say "follow the money" in looking at 9/11.
Now if I were to take this information and say that these producers were cold profiteers, that would be within the realm of possiblility. That would then mean they might be distorting and omitting evidence that might challenge their conclusion. If I said that, you could counter that I was saying more than the information (or, evidence) supported. And, you would be correct. I might be right, but I would have the burden of supporting my conclusion. Until or unless I can garner evidence, I am guilty of making a baseless allegation.
So, you (and the producers of this video, as stated on their website) start with the premise that the "official story cannot be true". So, lets not pretend this is an objective documentary. Second, they say that the US used 9/11 as a justification for invading Iraq. I agree with that conclusion. Where I differ is in trying to say that the government blew up the Trade Center and attacked the Pentagon in order to create a premise to invade Iraq. That leaps to conclusions the evidence does not support.
I propose we go point-by-point on where you think the evidence disputes the "official" theory. Then we can discuss where we agree or disagree.
So pick your first point.
_____________________________
"It's an effort to elevate one's language to sound more academic, more scholarly," Lucas said. "I don't think I'd give her an A for anything."- Brad Lucas of TCU on Palin's refudiate gaffe
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RE: Questions about 9/11 - 2/4/2010 4:03:51 PM
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tsnody2001
Posts: 1019
Joined: 4/29/2008
From: Terre Haute, IN
Status: offline
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Okay. Let's start with the lack of wreckage or plane debris at the site of the Pentagon. How do you explain that? Did the plane incinerate?
There is no evidence of wings hitting the building (there is on the WTCs). If the plane hit the building the way they say it did, the windows within the vicinity of where the wings would have hit should have been busted out. They were not.
We'll stop there for the moment and discuss those things. Then we'll move on.
But stop with the ridiculing statements and straw-men. They do not serve your purpose.
quote:
So, you (and the producers of this video, as stated on their website) start with the premise that the "official story cannot be true".
I do not start with the premise that the official start cannot be true. I believed the official story for six years because I had not looked at any of the evidence, but only believed what those "who know better" have told us was the truth. Once I was presented with some of the evidence, I began to ask questions, which led me to seek out more evidence, which led to even more questions, which has led me to no longer believe the official story.
quote:
That would then mean they might be distorting and omitting evidence that might challenge their conclusion.
You don't think the other side of the debate is capable of doing the same thing?
_____________________________
Until He Returns (Rev. 2:17),
Travis
During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act. ~George Orwell
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RE: Questions about 9/11 - 2/4/2010 4:04:19 PM
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Eutychus
Posts: 9221
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Dothan, AL
Status: online
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Travis, this theory that all of the 911 evidence doesn't add up reminds me of the Dark Sucker Theory. If you've never heard of it, it is just as compelling, IMO. And to prove that I'm willing to think outside conventional wisdom, here it is in brief:
For years it has been believed that electric bulbs emitted light. However, recent information from Bell Labs and contemplations by keen minds have proven otherwise. The new idea is that electric bulbs don't emit light, they suck dark. Thus they now call these bulbs dark suckers. The dark sucker theory, according to a leading dark sucker theorist Will Kerslake, proves the existence of dark, that dark has nearly infinite mass, and that the speed of dark is just slightly slower than the speed of what is considered "light".
More Compelling Evidence for this theory
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RE: Questions about 9/11 - 2/4/2010 4:04:58 PM
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tsnody2001
Posts: 1019
Joined: 4/29/2008
From: Terre Haute, IN
Status: offline
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But let me ask you a simple question..
Have you watched the film I linked above? Do you have any intention of watching the film?
_____________________________
Until He Returns (Rev. 2:17),
Travis
During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act. ~George Orwell
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